Re: Re: Renegade
By: Exodus to Mro on Tue Nov 05 2024 05:58 am
btw, where did you get this info about herrings? https://i.imgur com/lYB5yfD.png
"with a deep hurtful feeling of trust issues"
When he telnetted here and was bitching before I told him how I got the code.
well the code from rg gets passed around the same way all the time.
people take it over that cant program and then they try to find people to program for them.
I don't think the guy had deep hurtful feelings.
Plus he stopped working on it in 2001.
"From Jeff Herrings:
Hello everyone.
As I sit here, I find myself wondering if what I am about to say and do is perhaps either pre-mature or an honorable way to remember a great BBS
software. The fact of the matter is, I have been thinking this for quite sometime now and regardless of how many times I think this thought, I find myself coming up with the same answer(s).
When Cott Lang started Renegade BBS software, it was in my opinion as well
as many others I am sure, ahead of its time for any independent
programmer. Granted it might not have had a complex scripting language
(PCB for one) nor did it have it's own sharing/multi-tasking routines
(TBBS - The Bread Board System), however it did offer some of -the- best features with easily understandable configuration menus and at a price
that just could not be beat (for free).
Several years after Cott produced this fine software, he had made a
decision due to numerous reasons (no reason to go over -any- of them
again, no reason at -all-) to cease programming while he was still ahead
(or not). At this time the persistence of Patrick Spence and Gary Hall
paid off when Cott agreed to allow them to continue Renegade development.
A few more years went on, while Patrick and Gary were hard at work
ensuring updates were released, in which Renegade lived on. Unfortunately
(and as you'll soon see it happens) due to time restraints and other
things, the desire and opportunity for them to continue work on Renegade
was noticeably decreasing.
In my search for love of Renegade, I found there was no "Y2K" patch
currently available and I wondered why (I later found of the time
restraints and lacking desire). I emailed Patrick inquiring if my
assistance could be offered to help a "Y2K" patch be released before far
too long. He replied and at this time we worked out that I could then
carry the torch, with the many responsibilities, headaches, thrills and
sense of contribution that brought with it.
I was to say the least absolutely thrilled that after -many- years of contributing third party software for in my mind the best BBS software of
its kind, I could finally dive in and make updates and changes as I saw
fit. Those changes of course were always either implemented or thought
about with the best intentions in mind for all the Renegade BBS community.
However, they say history repeats itself and that it does. I find now,
more so in these past few weeks that I haven't the time nor desire to
continue work on Renegade BBS. The desire is not due to countless number
of emails (I am a bit glad I wasn't programming Renegade BBS during BBS
prime days of existence) I have received with pestering questions asking
the infamous "when is the next release, why are you taking so long, etc,
etc." (notice, I did NOT say the inquisitive emails, those I have never
minded what-so-ever), but instead that of respect for a once great BBS
software (which in my mind personally, will always be great), overwhelming family occurrences (some related to the repercussions of the most recent incidents against our country, mind you my wife is active military and is
as I type this in the middle of the ocean, where I do not know) and a
hectic move/business status.
So, out of respect for Renegade BBS (and those who contributed to it in
the past and present), those who used or use it and for myself... as of
today Sunday, October 7th, 2001 I bring the many chapters of Renegade BBS
to a close.
As always, I will continue to frequent BBS's via telnet and sometimes
dial-up whenever time permits. Those SysOp's that see me on their BBS's
know that I am usually on and off within a few minutes, though, I try to
make the best of those minutes, let it be via participation or just
nostalgic reasons.
With that said, I wish to thank EVERYONE that has ever been a part and/or
will continue to stay a part of the Renegade Community my best wishes in anything and everything you do BBS related or not. The time for me was enjoyable, very enjoyable time spent.
Sincerely,
Jeff Herrings
PS - I will continue to keep my word to Patrick Spence and in turn Cott
Lang by not offering the source code to anyone. I hope that you will only understand and accept this decision out of respect of both Patrick, Gary
and myself giving our word to never make it public domain/source.
PSS - I might add that even by the time I find that I am able to work on Renegade BBS (the completely re-vamped Windows/Unix flavor) other software suites that are currently available have such an edge, due to time of
existence and time to devote, that if I were to have ever or would ever
release this version, those other suites would have been one, two or quite possibly three steps ahead. This too was another, no matter how
insignificant, reason to lay Renegade BBS to rest.
"
he was probably curious how you got the code since spence was so protective of being the renegade guy for such a long time.
it was an ego thing.
here is spence's posting from 2000 talking about the handoff to Herrings:
"Patrick Spence, hands the reins of development of Renegade BBS Software to Jeff Herrings.
Reasons for giving up on Renegade, by Patrick Spence:
2000-01-16 Its that time.
I know I have said for the longest time that when I decided to quit
working on Renegade, that I would bury the source and there would be
no further work done. I have had a change of heart. I have selected
a sucker -ahem- fine programmer to replace me as active programmer.
Both my partner Gary and I have decided that we are going to start
working on newer projects, but don't want to see RG die.
The new programmer is named Jeff Herrings
jeffh@ariven.com and he
will be taking over production and work on RG as of today.
Gary and I will still keep our hand in, as we are retaining copies
of the source code, and I will remain as someone who can answer Jeffs
questions about the code to help him get up to speed.
Now we get to the reasons....
1. I said from the beginning that I was working on the code for ME,
not for anyone else, and having rude people writing me because I
don't do things their way or at their speed is annoying. Well I
haven't run a bbs in over a year, so I guess updating a bbs
program that I don't use is not the way I want to spend my time.
2. I am disappointed in several people who volunteered to help. If
I can't get people to help test stuff, there is no point in
working on it either, since I can't catch all the bugs, nor can
I spend all my time working on a free program.
3. I have new ideas that I want to implement, that I cannot
implement in a dos programming world.
(The Above is copyright 2000 by Patrick Spence, All Rights Reserved)"
Here is jeff's 2005 posting:
"===============================================================
09/25/05 - I decided to fire up mTelnet and 'call' around a few BBS's that
I visited while I was active in Renegade programming as well as after I
had presumptiously laid Renegade to rest (Patrick Spence decided to allow another person a shot). My first visit was "Dreamland BBS", the SysOp
"dm" had been a longtime Renegade supporter, was an Renegade BBS Alpha
node back in the "hay day" and offered much assistance to me when I was
the Renegade programmer. Upon my visit to his BBS, I took notice he was running Mystic BBS (a nice BBS package, however, it seems the creator of
this package got the dreaded "BBS Programmers Flu"), astonished to say the least, I decided to visit the Mystic BBS website. Upon my visit there and reading that it's creator seemed to have fallen off the face of the earth,
I read a post by "grem" which read simply : "It's not like someone's going
to steal the source and get lots of money and fame by releasing their own Mystic-based BBS software. BBSs are long past those days. Even if nothing happens with the project after the source is released it's still not a
loss; nothing happens as it is anyway." -- I thought, "How true."
Before this goes further, I want to say this; I DID make a promise to
Patrick Spence to NOT release the source code. That out of the way, I did
make such promise indeed, however, it was under the impression we were on
a friendly and mutual relationship. Recently it seemed for whatever
reason, I was shunt out. I'm not a man of revenge and I'd like to think I
do not act immaturely, however, this "shunting" of sorts was enough for me
to consider that promise made years ago to be null void.
That brings us to the release of the Renegade BBS version Y2K (the first
Y2K compliant version of Renegade released by me - Jeff Herrings) Alpha revision 2 (the reason for the 2nd revision is an embarassing one...
simply, put; I compiled and "zipped up" the wrong directory of a 'version'
that still had obvious and ridiculous bugs in it, due to my excitement of releasing the first Renegade Y2K compliant version). I decided to upload
the source code to the "Dreamland BBS" first, then suffice to say, I
visited every and any BBS I could to ensure it was released and the word
got out.
Needless to say, upon visiting bbsdocumentary.com (which I often do and am still contemplating on purchasing the DVD's now or actually allow my wife
to purchase them for me as a present) today on 09/27/05, low-and-behold
the source code has already made it's way around [the world --
undoubtedly]. However, with the description of "Purported Renegade 2
Source." So I felt the need to clarify the reasons, blanks and confusion,
as well as confirm the source code that I released is authentic and
-should- compile with no issues (using Turbo Pascal 7.0 atleast).
It's time the world is allowed to have what was so ridiculously guarded
after it was obvious that the "BBS scene" was dying (for the lack of a
better word). The only reason I can come up with as to why any source
code to a FREE software would be kept "locked up" is because the
programmer (s) wish to keep the "recognition" that he/she/they are...
'THE' programmers (ie. arrogance). Aside from, of course, promises made
for software such as Renegade BBS, albeit, it is said, "Promises are made
to be broken." Releasing the source code is my LAST contribution to
Renegade (may many talented persons hopefully revive it and get it up to
speed - not to discredit the current programmers!) and simply... the
BBSers.
===============================================================
"
anyways, it seems like you're trying to bend the facts or worse.
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